From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Wed Aug 1 03:19:57 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com) Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 22:19:57 EDT Subject: [303rd-Talk] Some Loose Ends, Boeing, and McDonnell-Douglas Message-ID: <70.dc67841.2898c14d@cs.com> --part1_70.dc67841.2898c14d_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Jack Rencher, This is my second attempt to send this message. The system may have become bogged down with the latest virus. As I stated in an earlier submittal, it is indeed sad when an aircraft manufacturer must merge with another to survive. This is especially poignant as so few US aircraft companies which contributed so much to the WWII war effort exist today as separate entities. If Airbus had never surfaced, I believe Boeing and McDonnell-Douglas would have maintained their respective commercial market shares for many years to come. Unfortunately, time takes its toll. This is not unlike the demise of the great American automobile names such as Cord, Duesenberg, Packard, etc. Best Wishes, John A. Jenkins 6910 Old Redmond Road Redmond, WA 98052 USA Phone (425) 885-0595 --part1_70.dc67841.2898c14d_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Jack Rencher,

      This is my second attempt to send this message. The system may have
become bogged down with the latest virus.

      As I stated in an earlier submittal, it is indeed sad when an aircraft
manufacturer must merge with another to survive. This is especially poignant
as so few US aircraft companies which contributed so much to the WWII war
effort exist today as separate entities. If Airbus had never surfaced, I
believe Boeing and McDonnell-Douglas would have maintained their respective
commercial market shares for many years to come. Unfortunately, time takes
its toll. This is not unlike the demise of the great American automobile
names such as Cord, Duesenberg, Packard, etc.

Best Wishes,

John A. Jenkins

6910 Old Redmond Road
Redmond, WA   98052   USA

Phone (425) 885-0595 --part1_70.dc67841.2898c14d_boundary-- From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Wed Aug 1 03:33:17 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com) Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 22:33:17 EDT Subject: [303rd-Talk] Some Loose Ends, Boeing, and McDonnell-Douglas Message-ID: <4f.f164984.2898c46d@cs.com> --part1_4f.f164984.2898c46d_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Bill Heller, This is my second attempt to send this message also. The name Harley Beard has a familiar ring, but I never met him. Looking through the Boeing sources I have available, I find that Beard and another Boeing test pilot were involved in personally demonstrating the 707 prototype (also known as the Dash 80) to Howard Hughes. Hughes was considering purchasing some 707s for TWA at the time. During one of the demonstration flights Hughes was at the controls and left the flaps extended at too high an airspeed. The Dash 80 had very strict speed limits for each flap setting. A piece of the flap separated and fell onto the car roof of an FAA employee. The FAA was waiting on the ground for the Dash 80 when it landed. Hughes managed to escape detection as one of the Boeing pilots took the blame. The pilots from Boeing found Hughes to be undisciplined in the cockpit. The Boeing sources also indicate that the Boeing-Hughes relationship was strained at times. The only Boeing test pilot that I have a personal connection with is Lew Wallick as I know his son. As I recall, Wallick was a test pilot for the first flights of the 737, 747, and 757 Programs. This list of programs may be incomplete. Best Wishes, John A. Jenkins 6910 Old Redmond Road Redmond, WA 98052 USA Phone (425) 885-0595 --part1_4f.f164984.2898c46d_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Bill Heller,

      This is my second attempt to send this message also.

      The name Harley Beard has a familiar ring, but I never met him.
Looking through the Boeing sources I have available, I find that Beard and
another Boeing test pilot were involved in personally demonstrating the 707
prototype (also known as the Dash 80) to Howard Hughes. Hughes was
considering purchasing some 707s for TWA at the time. During one of the
demonstration flights Hughes was at the controls and left the flaps extended
at too high an airspeed. The Dash 80 had very strict speed limits for each
flap setting. A piece of the flap separated and fell onto the car roof of an
FAA employee. The FAA was waiting on the ground for the Dash 80 when it
landed. Hughes managed to escape detection as one of the Boeing pilots took
the blame. The pilots from Boeing found Hughes to be undisciplined in the
cockpit. The Boeing sources also indicate that the Boeing-Hughes
relationship was strained at times.

      The only Boeing test pilot that I have a personal connection with is
Lew Wallick as I know his son. As I recall, Wallick was a test pilot for the
first flights of the 737, 747, and 757 Programs. This list of programs may
be incomplete.

Best Wishes,

John A. Jenkins

6910 Old Redmond Road
Redmond, WA   98052   USA

Phone (425) 885-0595 --part1_4f.f164984.2898c46d_boundary-- From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Wed Aug 1 04:26:06 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com) Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 23:26:06 EDT Subject: [303rd-Talk] Some Loose Ends, Boeing, and McDonnell-Douglas Message-ID: --part1_bc.1822225c.2898d0ce_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Bob Finley, During the 50th Anniversary celebration of the B17 in Seattle I recall spending a considerable amount of time looking at the WWII aircraft displayed at Boeing Field. I wish I had a greater interest in the 303rd BG at the time. I believe Forrest Vosler gave a short talk at some point during the 303rd reunion. It is not every day when you are able to listen to what a Congressional Medal of Honor recipient has to say. Best Wishes, John A. Jenkins 6910 Old Redmond Road Redmond, WA 98052 USA Phone (425) 885-0595 --part1_bc.1822225c.2898d0ce_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Bob Finley,

      During the 50th Anniversary celebration of the B17 in Seattle I recall
spending a considerable amount of time looking at the WWII aircraft displayed
at Boeing Field. I wish I had a greater interest in the 303rd BG at the
time. I believe Forrest Vosler gave a short talk at some point during the
303rd reunion. It is not every day when you are able to listen to what a
Congressional Medal of Honor recipient has to say.

Best Wishes,

John A. Jenkins

6910 Old Redmond Road
Redmond, WA   98052   USA

Phone (425) 885-0595 --part1_bc.1822225c.2898d0ce_boundary-- From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Wed Aug 1 09:16:52 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com) Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2001 04:16:52 EDT Subject: [303rd-Talk] Some Loose Ends, Boeing, and McDonnell-Douglas Message-ID: <116.2834bcb.289914f4@aol.com> John Jenkins Thanks John. I understand the reasons but saddened a bit by the results. Best Wishes, Jack Rencher Boise, Idaho From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Thu Aug 2 02:42:35 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com) Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2001 21:42:35 EDT Subject: [303rd-Talk] Some Loose Ends, Boeing, and McDonnell-Douglas Message-ID: <8b.a2e9823.289a0a0b@cs.com> --part1_8b.a2e9823.289a0a0b_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Spec, It is difficult to say what the recent move of the Boeing Corporate headquarters to Chicago really means. The former corporate offices have been located across from Boeing Field for many decades. I believe that the Boeing headquarters in Seattle witnessed the first flight of the Model 299 and the subsequent departure of all Boeing built B17s for wartime service. An era is certainly coming to a close. This move affects only about 400 people who agreed to move. Not all chose to go. I am certain that the move will not affect the real estate market as someone from Microsoft will snap up any vacant houses. The day to day operations of the Boeing Company been unaffected. The explanation given for the move was to relocate upper management to a more central location in the US and to diminish the influence of the Commercial Airplane Group. The Commercial Airplane Group is predominant in the Puget Sound area. The Everett Plant produces the 747, 767, and 777, while the Renton Plant builds the 737 and 757 aircraft. There may also be some underlying tax issues, but this has been denied by Boeing. Washington State and the Seattle area have come to rely on Boeing to pay some hefty taxes. This era may also be coming to an end. These are my views only. Someone else at Boeing may have a different perspective. I wish I understood this move better. It certainly caught me by surprise. Best Wishes, John A. Jenkins 6910 Old Redmond Road Redmond, WA 98052 USA Phone (425) 885-0595 --part1_8b.a2e9823.289a0a0b_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Spec,

      It is difficult to say what the recent move of the Boeing Corporate
headquarters to Chicago really means. The former corporate offices have been
located across from Boeing Field for many decades. I believe that the Boeing
headquarters in Seattle witnessed the first flight of the Model 299 and the
subsequent departure of all Boeing built B17s for wartime service. An era is
certainly coming to a close.

      This move affects only about 400 people who agreed to move. Not all
chose to go. I am certain that the move will not affect the real estate
market as someone from Microsoft will snap up any vacant houses. The day to
day operations of the Boeing Company been unaffected. The explanation given
for the move was to relocate upper management to a more central location in
the US and to diminish the influence of the Commercial Airplane Group. The
Commercial Airplane Group is predominant in the Puget Sound area. The
Everett Plant produces the 747, 767, and 777, while the Renton Plant builds
the 737 and 757 aircraft.

      There may also be some underlying tax issues, but this has been denied
by Boeing. Washington State and the Seattle area have come to rely on Boeing
to pay some hefty taxes. This era may also be coming to an end.

      These are my views only. Someone else at Boeing may have a different
perspective. I wish I understood this move better. It certainly caught me
by surprise.

Best Wishes,

John A. Jenkins

6910 Old Redmond Road
Redmond, WA   98052   USA

Phone (425) 885-0595 --part1_8b.a2e9823.289a0a0b_boundary-- From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Thu Aug 2 15:07:36 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com) Date: Thu, 2 Aug 2001 10:07:36 EDT Subject: [303rd-Talk] Some Loose Ends, Boeing, and McDonnell-Douglas Message-ID: <30.188cb9f5.289ab8a8@aol.com> relocations are economichurts and human trials. here reynolds metals hdqts. for generations ,now bought by alcoa appear to be moving from here to pittsburg. very very exceptional office park within acreage well manicured with own horticulture forces. tough ,but true. in our case and i guess in boeings that these execs did not have or use a , to stockholders detriment, friendly dollars parachute. cheers. spec to jenkins From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Thu Aug 2 23:46:20 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Gary Moncur) Date: Thu, 2 Aug 2001 15:46:20 -0700 Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems Message-ID: <3B6975CC.22722.1C28C6@localhost> Hopefully this message will get through. The list has been having problems at our server in Pittsburgh. Tech support still hasnt responed to my message, but it is being addressed. If you get this, please reply with a "got it" or something to generate some list mail. Hang in there, we're still around! - Gary - Webmaster, 303rd Bomb Group Association http://www.303rdBGA.com http://www.B17Thunderbird.com From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Thu Aug 2 22:50:14 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Bill Jones) Date: Thu, 2 Aug 2001 17:50:14 -0400 Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems In-Reply-To: <3B6975CC.22722.1C28C6@localhost> Message-ID: <200108022158.f72LwIL25934@ns1.megalink.net> On 2 Aug 01, at 15:46, Gary Moncur wrote: > Hopefully this message will get through. The list has been having > problems at our server in Pittsburgh. Tech support still hasnt > responed to my message, but it is being addressed. If you get this, > please reply with a "got it" or something to generate some list mail. > Hang in there, we're still around! Got it. Bill Jones Sweden Maine N3JLQ wejones@megalink.net htpp://www.megalink.net/~wejones TVRO,Space,Ham radio,WX htpp://www.megalink.net/~wejones/wwii.html B-17/wwii/303rdBG From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Thu Aug 2 22:51:14 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com) Date: Thu, 2 Aug 2001 17:51:14 EDT Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems Message-ID: <106.38474c1.289b2552@gateway.net> Got it... From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Thu Aug 2 23:15:15 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Ed Lamme) Date: Thu, 2 Aug 2001 15:15:15 -0700 Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problem Message-ID: <001501c11ba0$9bb78ee0$162564d8@computer> Got it OK Ed Lamme From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Thu Aug 2 23:16:23 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (David Y) Date: Thu, 2 Aug 2001 15:16:23 -0700 Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems References: <3B6975CC.22722.1C28C6@localhost> Message-ID: <000d01c11ba0$c49b1660$a18de0d8@h4k3401> Got it ______________________________________________________ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary Moncur" To: <303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com> Sent: Thursday, August 02, 2001 3:46 PM Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems Hopefully this message will get through. From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Thu Aug 2 23:17:47 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com) Date: Thu, 2 Aug 2001 18:17:47 EDT Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems Message-ID: Hang in there - I got it! From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Thu Aug 2 23:20:34 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Edward L Frank) Date: Thu, 02 Aug 2001 18:20:34 -0400 Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems In-Reply-To: <3B6975CC.22722.1C28C6@localhost> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20010802182000.009f3ec0@home.1usa.com> I got it. At 06:46 PM 8/2/01, you wrote: >Hopefully this message will get through. The list has been having > > >- Gary - Webmaster, 303rd Bomb Group Association > http://www.303rdBGA.com > http://www.B17Thunderbird.com From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Fri Aug 3 04:01:23 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (John) Date: Thu, 02 Aug 2001 20:01:23 -0700 Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems References: <200108022158.f72LwIL25934@ns1.megalink.net> Message-ID: <3B6A1403.BDB1ECF2@frontiernet.net> got it. Bill Jones wrote: > On 2 Aug 01, at 15:46, Gary Moncur wrote: > > > Hopefully this message will get through. The list has been having > > problems at our server in Pittsburgh. Tech support still hasnt > > responed to my message, but it is being addressed. If you get this, > > please reply with a "got it" or something to generate some list mail. > > Hang in there, we're still around! > > Got it. > > Bill Jones Sweden Maine N3JLQ wejones@megalink.net > htpp://www.megalink.net/~wejones TVRO,Space,Ham radio,WX > htpp://www.megalink.net/~wejones/wwii.html B-17/wwii/303rdBG From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Fri Aug 3 01:20:49 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com) Date: Thu, 2 Aug 2001 20:20:49 EDT Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems Message-ID: --part1_d2.a3d12ea.289b4861_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi: I got It. Brooklyn Bill --part1_d2.a3d12ea.289b4861_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi:
I got It.
      Brooklyn Bill --part1_d2.a3d12ea.289b4861_boundary-- From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Fri Aug 3 01:52:54 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com) Date: Thu, 2 Aug 2001 20:52:54 EDT Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems Message-ID: <9c.1195ed1b.289b4fe6@aol.com> --part1_9c.1195ed1b.289b4fe6_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This is Paul O. Harmon I was in the 1199th M. P. Co... I arrived at 303rd bomb GP in Jan. 1944 and left June 8,1945 Went to Afica at Casablanca Then to Dakar left for home using northern route. I went over to the U. K. in 1943 i was station at Bushy Park which I never hear none of you talk about it I think that the 1109 thM.P Co was the first M.Ps there It was the 8 th air force Hq s the war rooms was there when IKE took it over the 8th move to pine tree . a month later I was sent to Molesworth Hey I GOT IT. ps this the first time I did my one finger type since 1947 Paul O. Harmon . --part1_9c.1195ed1b.289b4fe6_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This is Paul O. Harmon I was in the 1199th M. P. Co... I arrived at
303rd bomb GP in Jan. 1944 and left June 8,1945 Went to Afica
at Casablanca Then to Dakar left for home using northern route.
  I went over to the U. K. in 1943 i was station at Bushy Park which
I never hear none of you talk about it I think that the 1109 thM.P Co
was the first M.Ps there   It was the 8 th air force Hq s the war rooms
was there when IKE took it over the 8th move to pine tree . a month
later I was sent to Molesworth Hey I GOT IT.
ps this the first time I did my one finger type since 1947

       Paul O. Harmon     . --part1_9c.1195ed1b.289b4fe6_boundary-- From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Fri Aug 3 02:08:50 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Gordon Alton) Date: Thu, 2 Aug 2001 18:08:50 -0700 Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems References: <3B6975CC.22722.1C28C6@localhost> Message-ID: <002a01c11bb8$db9e4680$1809f4cc@e0y0k4> Got you loud and clear, Gary. Gordy. "tailgunnerson" ****************************************** "Our freedom is not free. Please remember those who fought to keep it." Gordon L. Alton 129 Mariko Place Salt Spring Island, BC, Can V8K1E1 ph 250-537-5913 gordy@saltspring.com ****************************************** ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary Moncur" To: <303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com> Sent: Thursday, August 02, 2001 3:46 PM Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems > Hopefully this message will get through. The list has been having > problems at our server in Pittsburgh. Tech support still hasnt > responed to my message, but it is being addressed. If you get this, > please reply with a "got it" or something to generate some list mail. > Hang in there, we're still around! > > - Gary - Webmaster, 303rd Bomb Group Association > http://www.303rdBGA.com > http://www.B17Thunderbird.com From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Fri Aug 3 03:12:12 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Bill Owen) Date: Thu, 2 Aug 2001 21:12:12 -0500 Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems References: <200108022158.f72LwIL25934@ns1.megalink.net> Message-ID: <000b01c11bc1$b6a6b020$1f3f22d1@billowen> Got it in Tyler, Tx.......Bill Owen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Jones" To: <303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com> Sent: Thursday, August 02, 2001 4:50 PM Subject: Re: [303rd-Talk] list problems > On 2 Aug 01, at 15:46, Gary Moncur wrote: > > > Hopefully this message will get through. The list has been having > > problems at our server in Pittsburgh. Tech support still hasnt > > responed to my message, but it is being addressed. If you get this, > > please reply with a "got it" or something to generate some list mail. > > Hang in there, we're still around! > > > Got it. > > > Bill Jones Sweden Maine N3JLQ wejones@megalink.net > htpp://www.megalink.net/~wejones TVRO,Space,Ham radio,WX > htpp://www.megalink.net/~wejones/wwii.html B-17/wwii/303rdBG > > From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Fri Aug 3 03:15:07 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com) Date: Thu, 2 Aug 2001 22:15:07 EDT Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems Message-ID: <85.deac658.289b632b@aol.com> got it. spec From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Fri Aug 3 03:42:23 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com) Date: Thu, 2 Aug 2001 22:42:23 EDT Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems Message-ID: <29.1899a911.289b698f@cs.com> --part1_29.1899a911.289b698f_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Gary, Some of my recent emails disappeared completely and had to be resubmitted. My last email appeared after a three hour delay. I received your request for a communication check. Regards, John A. Jenkins 6910 Old Redmond Road Redmond, WA 98052 USA Phone (425) 885-0595 --part1_29.1899a911.289b698f_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Gary,
      Some of my recent emails disappeared completely and had to be
resubmitted. My last email appeared after a three hour delay. I received
your request for a communication check.

Regards,

John A. Jenkins

6910 Old Redmond Road
Redmond, WA   98052   USA

Phone (425) 885-0595 --part1_29.1899a911.289b698f_boundary-- From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Fri Aug 3 04:06:24 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com) Date: Thu, 2 Aug 2001 23:06:24 EDT Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems Message-ID: --part1_bc.18420bdc.289b6f30_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Got it. --part1_bc.18420bdc.289b6f30_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Got it. --part1_bc.18420bdc.289b6f30_boundary-- From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Fri Aug 3 04:22:15 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Mike McClanahan) Date: Thu, 02 Aug 2001 21:22:15 -0600 Subject: [303rd-Talk] Re: Server probs. References: <20010803031001.3CFC653681@pairlist.net> Message-ID: <3B6A18E7.95750F7F@uswest.net> My condolences. The Qwest server was down today too and blacked out Denver, Mpls/St Paul and Phoenix. But it's better now, so I got your post. Mike McClanahan From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Fri Aug 3 04:30:27 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Jim Walling) Date: Thu, 02 Aug 2001 17:30:27 -1000 Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems In-Reply-To: <3B6975CC.22722.1C28C6@localhost> Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.20010802173027.008f0850@ilhawaii.net> Got it. jim At 03:46 PM 8/2/01 -0700, you wrote: >Hopefully this message will get through. The list has been having >problems at our server in Pittsburgh. Tech support still hasnt >responed to my message, but it is being addressed. If you get this, >please reply with a "got it" or something to generate some list mail. >Hang in there, we're still around! > >- Gary - Webmaster, 303rd Bomb Group Association > http://www.303rdBGA.com > http://www.B17Thunderbird.com > > > From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Fri Aug 3 05:18:26 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Bob Rettinhouse) Date: Thu, 2 Aug 2001 21:18:26 -0700 Subject: [303rd-Talk] Got Message Message-ID: <003701c11bd3$58bcc460$72ad1818@we.mediaone.net> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0034_01C11B98.AB72F020 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Gary : Got it. Hang in there. Bob Rettinhouse ------=_NextPart_000_0034_01C11B98.AB72F020 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Gary :

Got it. Hang in there.

= =20 Bob Rettinhouse

------=_NextPart_000_0034_01C11B98.AB72F020-- From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Fri Aug 3 06:16:58 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com) Date: Fri, 03 Aug 2001 05:16:58 +0000 Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems Message-ID: <20010803051658.JQTK18077.mtiwmhc26.worldnet.att.net@webmail.worldnet.att.net> Got it Bill Runnels > Got it. jim > > > At 03:46 PM 8/2/01 -0700, you wrote: > >Hopefully this message will get through. The list has been having > >problems at our server in Pittsburgh. Tech support still hasnt > >responed to my message, but it is being addressed. If you get this, > >please reply with a "got it" or something to generate some list mail. > >Hang in there, we're still around! > > > >- Gary - Webmaster, 303rd Bomb Group Association > > http://www.303rdBGA.com > > http://www.B17Thunderbird.com > > > > > > > From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Fri Aug 3 06:33:49 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com) Date: Fri, 3 Aug 2001 01:33:49 EDT Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems Message-ID: <10e.34dfb85.289b91bd@aol.com> got it. Jack Rencher From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Fri Aug 3 08:18:46 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (William Heller) Date: Fri, 03 Aug 2001 00:18:46 -0700 Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems References: <200108022158.f72LwIL25934@ns1.megalink.net> Message-ID: <3B6A5056.F53AB0C3@attglobal.net> Got it! Bill Heller Bill Jones wrote: > On 2 Aug 01, at 15:46, Gary Moncur wrote: > > > Hopefully this message will get through. The list has been having > > problems at our server in Pittsburgh. Tech support still hasnt > > responed to my message, but it is being addressed. If you get this, > > please reply with a "got it" or something to generate some list mail. > > Hang in there, we're still around! > > Got it. > > Bill Jones Sweden Maine N3JLQ wejones@megalink.net > htpp://www.megalink.net/~wejones TVRO,Space,Ham radio,WX > htpp://www.megalink.net/~wejones/wwii.html B-17/wwii/303rdBG From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Fri Aug 3 13:19:26 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Duke Drewry) Date: Fri, 03 Aug 2001 07:19:26 -0500 Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems Message-ID: Got it Gary--thanks for your attention Duke From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Fri Aug 3 14:45:50 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com) Date: Fri, 3 Aug 2001 09:45:50 EDT Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems Message-ID: Hi Gordy....sneaking in an edge wordwise, have swapped the sunny (oops!) climes of West Palm, Florida for the ungodly hills of Johnson City TN....a move accomplished in record time with nothing serious broken or lost. Computer was out some nine days while my good wife Nyela threaded the system back into operation. Had some 209 messages stacked up and waiting. Looking forward to making local contacts....now where the heck is my 303rd file???? Good Health, Good Spirits to all.....Bob and Nyela Hand From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Fri Aug 3 14:17:41 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Lloyd J Grant) Date: Fri, 3 Aug 2001 09:17:41 -0400 Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems References: <3B6975CC.22722.1C28C6@localhost> Message-ID: <004601c11c1e$ae1828a0$a8b34d0c@o3n4f8> Get a good grip on your "D" rings friends, I have returned earlier than expected. Regards to all. ( what ever it is , I "got it" too). Lloyd ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary Moncur" From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Fri Aug 3 15:26:14 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Kevin Pearson) Date: Fri, 03 Aug 2001 09:26:14 -0500 Subject: [303rd-Talk] Got it! Message-ID: >From: "Gary Moncur" >Reply-To: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com >To: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com >Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems >Date: Thu, 2 Aug 2001 15:46:20 -0700 > >Hopefully this message will get through. The list has been having >problems at our server in Pittsburgh. Tech support still hasnt >responed to my message, but it is being addressed. If you get this, >please reply with a "got it" or something to generate some list mail. >Hang in there, we're still around! > >- Gary - Webmaster, 303rd Bomb Group Association > http://www.303rdBGA.com > http://www.B17Thunderbird.com > _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Fri Aug 3 15:30:03 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Kevin Pearson) Date: Fri, 03 Aug 2001 09:30:03 -0500 Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems Message-ID: Gary: I sent four messages to the Ring and they never posted on the board. After number four, I quit trying. Hope things are getting back to normal and I'm glad to see everyone is still checking in! Kevin >From: JJENKINSR@cs.com >Reply-To: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com >To: 303rd-talk@303rdbga.com >Subject: Re: [303rd-Talk] list problems >Date: Thu, 2 Aug 2001 22:42:23 EDT > >Gary, > Some of my recent emails disappeared completely and had to be >resubmitted. My last email appeared after a three hour delay. I received >your request for a communication check. > >Regards, > >John A. Jenkins > >6910 Old Redmond Road >Redmond, WA 98052 USA > >Phone (425) 885-0595 _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Fri Aug 3 15:36:41 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Kevin Pearson) Date: Fri, 03 Aug 2001 09:36:41 -0500 Subject: [303rd-Talk] CCRC Message-ID: Now that the Ring appears to be up and running again, perhaps I could throw a question out to ya'll. After your guys arrived in England, what happened? Did you park you plane and go to a Combat Crew Replacement Center? Did you get orders and fly to a Group? Did you ferry your ship to a Base Air Depot for field modifications? And if you went to a CCRC, what was it like, what did you do while there, and how long were you there. I haven't read much about CCRCs and am curious. Good to see everyone is still alive and kickin! Kevin _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Fri Aug 3 15:42:13 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Kevin Pearson) Date: Fri, 03 Aug 2001 09:42:13 -0500 Subject: [303rd-Talk] KLM 007 for Bill Heller Message-ID: I watched a show the other night on, I think, the doomed flight of KLM 007 or KLA 007, the 747 that departed Anchorage, ended up flying over Russian Airspace, and then was shot down by a Russian fighter. The show told how the 747 was severely off course, flying several hundred miles north of its scheduled course. The show also theorized that maybe, just maybe, the 747 had monitoring equipment on board and the pilot was flying a mission for the government. I'm sure you have heard of this disaster, too. What do you know about this strange flight. Do you have any theories? Sorry, Gary, I know this is off course with the intent of this forum, but I don't know any other 747 captains. Kevin _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Fri Aug 3 16:41:39 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com) Date: Fri, 3 Aug 2001 11:41:39 EDT Subject: [303rd-Talk] Re: 303rd-Talk digest, List Problems Message-ID: Got it!! From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Fri Aug 3 17:42:27 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Maurice Paulk) Date: Fri, 3 Aug 2001 11:42:27 -0500 Subject: [303rd-Talk] You are coming through Message-ID: <000801c11c3b$493bf980$13bb9ace@mjpmtman> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C11C11.5EED0D20 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable 5 X 5 --loud and clear--I got it too--- Maurice Paulk ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C11C11.5EED0D20 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

5 X 5 --loud and clear--I got it too--- = Maurice=20 Paulk

------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C11C11.5EED0D20-- From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Fri Aug 3 18:31:26 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (William Heller) Date: Fri, 03 Aug 2001 10:31:26 -0700 Subject: [303rd-Talk] KLM 007 for Bill Heller References: Message-ID: <3B6ADFED.35D8EC58@attglobal.net> Kevin Pearson ... KAL (Korean Air Lines) Flight 007 was on a flight from ANC to, I believe, Seoul. I have flown this route MANY times. It is called NORPAC and has routes numbered along such airways over the North Pacific. You fly along the Aleutian Chain out toward Shemya when you make a turn more Southward so as to avoid the Kurile Island chain just South of Kamchatka. Many times those of us flying this route would see others. Different airlines. At different altitudes. But since the routes came so close to certain waypoints, these other airlines were visible. At times, during day flights, the Russian Bear Bomber would come up alongside and wave to the passengers. Then they would flit down and under us and come up on the other side, waving and smiling at the passengers. This wea merely Russia "patrolling" areas of open Skies - which they are allowed to do. While I mention this, it has NOTHING to do with KAL 007. BUT, many times we would be making position reports and therefore KNOW who else was in the area. MANY times we would see a KAL plane NOT turn to the South when passing Shemya, BUT, continue on to overhead the Kuriles South of Kanchatka and proceed toward Korea. (A MUCH SHORTER ROUTE for them). This we saw MANY times but until the KAL 007 disaster, did not think much about it. When an airliner flys the NORPAC routes, they tell you in BIG PRINT, NOT to violate the routing structures or MAJOR DISASTER COULD OBTAIN! So, the airlines are fairly warned when flying this route ... IN THOSE DAYS ... It may be different now. BUT, for your information, KAL was off course, as they often were ... and if he read his charts properly he KNEW OF THE DANGER. Anent any clandestine thoughts or ideas about WHY KAL was shot down, I do not believe any of it. I just believe the Russians were finally sick and tired of people NOT following the rules ... and decided to take action. One (no matter WHO you are) can only be taunted just so much before your basic instincts take over. This may answer SOME of your queries and there may be others who have ideas on the issue. The above are MY ideas. After 368 MidPac and NorPac crossings as an airline Captain, I offer the above. Cheers! Bill Heller Kevin Pearson wrote: > I watched a show the other night on, I think, the doomed flight of KLM 007 > or KLA 007, the 747 that departed Anchorage, ended up flying over Russian > Airspace, and then was shot down by a Russian fighter. > > The show told how the 747 was severely off course, flying several hundred > miles north of its scheduled course. The show also theorized that maybe, > just maybe, the 747 had monitoring equipment on board and the pilot was > flying a mission for the government. I'm sure you have heard of this > disaster, too. > > What do you know about this strange flight. Do you have any theories? > > Sorry, Gary, I know this is off course with the intent of this forum, but I > don't know any other 747 captains. > Kevin > > _________________________________________________________________ > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Fri Aug 3 20:16:36 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Kevin Pearson) Date: Fri, 03 Aug 2001 14:16:36 -0500 Subject: [303rd-Talk] KLM 007 for Bill Heller Message-ID: Bill: Thanks much for your observations about KAL 007! In the program I watched, it showed the check points along the way but made it sound like KAL 007s deviation from the prescribed route was a major anomoly. According to what you have said, it was a fairly frequent procedure. The show did say that the route flown by KAL was a much shorter one, but made it sound as if the Captain was just trying to save time and it did not happen often if at all. Very interesting! As Paul Harvey would say, "And now you know the rest of the story!" Kevin >From: William Heller >Reply-To: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com >To: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com >Subject: Re: [303rd-Talk] KLM 007 for Bill Heller >Date: Fri, 03 Aug 2001 10:31:26 -0700 > >Kevin Pearson ... > >KAL (Korean Air Lines) Flight 007 was on a flight from ANC to, I believe, >Seoul. I have flown this route MANY times. It is called NORPAC and has >routes >numbered along such airways over the North Pacific. You fly along the >Aleutian >Chain out toward Shemya when you make a turn more Southward so as to avoid >the >Kurile Island chain just South of Kamchatka. Many times those of us flying >this route would see others. Different airlines. At different altitudes. >But >since the routes came so close to certain waypoints, these other airlines >were >visible. At times, during day flights, the Russian Bear Bomber would come >up >alongside and wave to the passengers. Then they would flit down and under >us >and come up on the other side, waving and smiling at the passengers. This >wea >merely Russia "patrolling" areas of open Skies - which they are allowed to >do. While I mention this, it has NOTHING to do with KAL 007. BUT, many >times >we would be making position reports and therefore KNOW who else was in the >area. MANY times we would see a KAL plane NOT turn to the South when >passing >Shemya, BUT, continue on to overhead the Kuriles South of Kanchatka and >proceed toward Korea. (A MUCH SHORTER ROUTE for them). This we saw MANY >times >but until the KAL 007 disaster, did not think much about it. > >When an airliner flys the NORPAC routes, they tell you in BIG PRINT, NOT to >violate the routing structures or MAJOR DISASTER COULD OBTAIN! So, the >airlines are fairly warned when flying this route ... IN THOSE DAYS ... It >may >be different now. BUT, for your information, KAL was off course, as they >often >were ... and if he read his charts properly he KNEW OF THE DANGER. > >Anent any clandestine thoughts or ideas about WHY KAL was shot down, I do >not >believe any of it. I just believe the Russians were finally sick and tired >of >people NOT following the rules ... and decided to take action. One (no >matter >WHO you are) can only be taunted just so much before your basic instincts >take >over. > >This may answer SOME of your queries and there may be others who have ideas >on >the issue. The above are MY ideas. After 368 MidPac and NorPac crossings as >an >airline Captain, I offer the above. > >Cheers! > >Bill Heller > > >Kevin Pearson wrote: > > > I watched a show the other night on, I think, the doomed flight of KLM >007 > > or KLA 007, the 747 that departed Anchorage, ended up flying over >Russian > > Airspace, and then was shot down by a Russian fighter. > > > > The show told how the 747 was severely off course, flying several >hundred > > miles north of its scheduled course. The show also theorized that maybe, > > just maybe, the 747 had monitoring equipment on board and the pilot was > > flying a mission for the government. I'm sure you have heard of this > > disaster, too. > > > > What do you know about this strange flight. Do you have any theories? > > > > Sorry, Gary, I know this is off course with the intent of this forum, >but I > > don't know any other 747 captains. > > Kevin > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at >http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp > > _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Fri Aug 3 22:26:28 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com) Date: Fri, 3 Aug 2001 17:26:28 EDT Subject: [303rd-Talk] Re:Vol 1 # 348 -mes.# 3 j-jen; Boeing Message-ID: --part1_e6.1938af5f.289c7104_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To All, Re: the 50th anniversary of the Boeing..B-17, the picture of the B-17 that i have , I had framed and glass put on both sides so you could read the backside if you cared to..it is very heavy..on another note, the B-17 that my first pilot, Lt. Jokerst and I flew to England in June of 1943..had Vega's bomb bay door and they let a lot of fresh air in but was always cold. cheers Bill Bergeron --part1_e6.1938af5f.289c7104_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To All,
Re: the 50th anniversary of the Boeing..B-17, the picture of the B-17
that i have , I had framed and glass put on both sides so you could read the
backside if you cared to..it is very heavy..on another note, the B-17 that my
first pilot, Lt. Jokerst and I flew to England in June of 1943..had Vega's
bomb bay door and they let a lot of fresh air in but was always cold.
cheers
Bill Bergeron --part1_e6.1938af5f.289c7104_boundary-- From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Fri Aug 3 23:09:48 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Dick Smith) Date: Fri, 3 Aug 2001 15:09:48 -0700 Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems References: <200108022158.f72LwIL25934@ns1.megalink.net> Message-ID: <000b01c11c69$036e7940$50f833cf@richards> Got it. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Jones" To: <303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com> Sent: Thursday, August 02, 2001 2:50 PM Subject: Re: [303rd-Talk] list problems > On 2 Aug 01, at 15:46, Gary Moncur wrote: > > > Hopefully this message will get through. The list has been having > > problems at our server in Pittsburgh. Tech support still hasnt > > responed to my message, but it is being addressed. If you get this, > > please reply with a "got it" or something to generate some list mail. > > Hang in there, we're still around! > > > Got it. > > > Bill Jones Sweden Maine N3JLQ wejones@megalink.net > htpp://www.megalink.net/~wejones TVRO,Space,Ham radio,WX > htpp://www.megalink.net/~wejones/wwii.html B-17/wwii/303rdBG From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Fri Aug 3 23:20:22 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (THOMAS ZINCK) Date: Sat, 4 Aug 2001 00:20:22 +0200 Subject: [303rd-Talk] (no subject) Message-ID: <001201c11c6a$7d332720$6515edd5@gorf> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C11C7B.402E0F00 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable got it(plus 972 others received during the last months) greetings from Thomas Denmark ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C11C7B.402E0F00 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

got it(plus 972 others received during = the last=20 months)

greetings from

Thomas

Denmark

------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C11C7B.402E0F00-- From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Fri Aug 3 23:35:44 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Louis Grandwilliams) Date: Fri, 3 Aug 2001 18:35:44 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems In-Reply-To: "Gary Moncur" 's message of Thu, 2 Aug 2001 15:46:20 -0700 Message-ID: <26493-3B6B2740-1129@storefull-137.iap.bryant.webtv.net> --WebTV-Mail-26876-517 Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit "Got It" --WebTV-Mail-26876-517 Content-Description: signature Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/HTML; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit --WebTV-Mail-26876-517-- From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Fri Aug 3 21:44:50 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Lloyd J Grant) Date: Fri, 3 Aug 2001 16:44:50 -0400 Subject: [303rd-Talk] The Moleworth tape Message-ID: <002001c11c5d$25cb47e0$6e184e0c@o3n4f8> To all: The tape originally provided by Don Kehne, which might have been more suitably titled, " The Kellog Tape" has now run the course. I would like to thank everyone who participated and contributed to the distribution of the tape. As far as I am concerned, it was worth the effort if it brought any satisfaction at all to those who viewed it. Special thanks to Don Kehne ( who provided the tape originally), Harry Goebrecht ( who provided an explaination of the various scenes), Bill Jones ( who took the time to research the tape and share his information), to Bill Owens ( who indentified the various aircraft and serial numbers) , Gary Moncur for providing extra copies ( which I gave away to other members), Anne Grant for relaying messages to the Group while I was absent, to Maurice Paulk for providing a copy to the Florida members ( I still have your copy, pard ), to Donna Morrows for paying the extra postage to get a copy to Robin Beeby in the UK ( one of Garys'), and to everyone for the solidarity and comradery expressed when I went TDY away from the forum. Hopefully, I will be a mellower feller now that I am back, but I recommend you keep on good terms with your parachute riggers, none-the-less. I missed you all; and that's no embellishment of the truth. Thank you. Lloyd. From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Sat Aug 4 02:24:20 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Bill Owen) Date: Fri, 3 Aug 2001 20:24:20 -0500 Subject: [303rd-Talk] Fw: Geezers Message-ID: <004601c11c84$306571e0$0e3f22d1@billowen> To all the Old Geezers of the 303rd--I'm not quite as old as you who served in the 303rd, but I am of the same generation. This was sent to me and I saw a lot of truth in it. Maybe some of you Old Geezers will enjoy it. Cheers , Bill Owen > Subject: Geezers > > "OLD GEEZERS" > > "Geezers" are easy to spot; this is slang for an old man. But, at > > sporting events, during the playing of the National Anthem, they > > hold their caps over their hearts and sing without embarrassment. > > They know the words and believe in them. > > They remember World War I, the Depression, World War II, Pearl > > Harbor, Guadalcanal, Normandy and Hitler. They remember the > > Atomic Age, the Korean War, The Cold War, the Jet Age and the > > Moon Landing, not to mention Vietnam. > > If you bump into a "Geezer" on the sidewalk, he'll apologize; pass > > a Geezer on the street, he'll nod, or tip his cap to a lady. > > "Geezers" trust strangers and are courtly to women. They hold the > > door for the next person and always when walking, make sure the > > lady is on the inside for protection. > > "Geezers" get embarrassed if someone curses in front of women > > and children and they don't like violence and filth on TV and in movies. > > Geezers have moral courage. > > Geezers seldom brag unless it's about the grandchildren in Little > > League or music recitals. > > This country needs "Geezers" with their decent values and common > > sense. We need them now more than ever. It's the "Geezers" who > > know our great country is protected, not by politicians or police, but > > by the young men and women in the military serving their country in > > foreign lands, just as they did, without a thought except to do a good > > job, the best you can, and to get home to loved ones. > > > > > From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Sat Aug 4 06:13:20 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com) Date: Sat, 4 Aug 2001 01:13:20 EDT Subject: [303rd-Talk] The Moleworth tape Message-ID: bravo lloyd From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Sat Aug 4 06:29:44 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Gordon Alton) Date: Fri, 3 Aug 2001 22:29:44 -0700 Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems References: Message-ID: <004401c11ca6$781b79e0$5b09f4cc@e0y0k4> Hi Bob, What made you move, Bob. I that you and Nyela liked it where you were. I bet it's to be close to the kids, or something like that. If you can't find you 303rd file, I'll send you a copy of mine. Just let me know. Thanks for the note. Gordy. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: <303rd-talk@303rdbga.com> Sent: Friday, August 03, 2001 6:45 AM Subject: Re: [303rd-Talk] list problems > Hi Gordy....sneaking in an edge wordwise, have swapped the sunny (oops!) > climes of West Palm, Florida for the ungodly hills of Johnson City TN....a > move accomplished in record time with nothing serious broken or lost. > Computer was out some nine days while my good wife Nyela threaded the system > back into operation. Had some 209 messages stacked up and waiting. Looking > forward to making local contacts....now where the heck is my 303rd file???? > Good Health, Good Spirits to all.....Bob and Nyela Hand From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Sat Aug 4 06:34:10 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com) Date: Sat, 4 Aug 2001 01:34:10 EDT Subject: [303rd-Talk] CCRC Message-ID: <4d.f46c3d9.289ce352@aol.com> Kevin, Our crew did not fly a plane to England. We went over on an English ship, The Aquatania as I remember. Our first assignment was at an airport just on the edge of London. I don't remember the name of it. The Pilots and Navigator were there. I don't remember where the rest of the crew went. We were there about 2 or 3 weeks and studied the Gee Box. It was the first I had ever heard of it. It proved to be a life saver to us several times. I have used it few times to land when it was absolutely Zero Zero. Once when we got on the ground and stopped we opened the pilots window and stuck our head out and could not see the ground with a flash light and it was daytime. Not night. After we finished there our crew was reunited and we were assigned to Molesworth. It was a lucky assignment. The 303rd was certainly one of the better and probably the best Bomb Group in the 8th Air Force. Another bit of luck. I was trained to be a P38 pilot. I didn't like it when they put me in B17s but I learned to love them. I probably would not have lived through the war if I had stayed in fighters. Best Wishes, Jack Rencher Box 7927 Boise, Idaho 83707 From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Sat Aug 4 19:09:22 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com) Date: Sat, 4 Aug 2001 14:09:22 EDT Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems Message-ID: <23.f642960.289d9452@aol.com> --part1_23.f642960.289d9452_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Got IT! Bob Finley --part1_23.f642960.289d9452_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Got IT!                                     Bob Finley --part1_23.f642960.289d9452_boundary-- From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Sat Aug 4 19:33:48 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com) Date: Sat, 4 Aug 2001 14:33:48 EDT Subject: [303rd-Talk] CCRC Message-ID: --part1_fd.a0e5df7.289d9a0c_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dear Kevin, We landed at Prestwick, Scotland, parking our "kite" by the caravan as instructed. We didn't see our B17G until later when it was ferried by someone else. We were split in two segments in Grand Island, Nebraska and assigned to fly as passengers with ATC crews. I assisted their crew with drift readings and setting the automatic pilot for the pilot. The other half of our had a more eventful trip. You can read about that in Sam Fleming's book "Flying With the Hells Angels". And, yes we did spend some time at CCRC. Bob Finley, Bombardier 360th sqdrn --part1_fd.a0e5df7.289d9a0c_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dear Kevin, We landed at Prestwick, Scotland, parking our "kite" by the
caravan as
instructed. We didn't see our B17G until later when it was ferried by
someone else.
We were split in two segments in Grand Island, Nebraska and assigned to fly
as passengers with ATC crews. I assisted their crew with drift readings and
setting the automatic pilot for the pilot. The other half of our had a more
eventful trip. You can read about that in Sam Fleming's book "Flying With the
Hells Angels".
And, yes we did spend some time at CCRC.
                                                                 Bob Finley,
Bombardier 360th sqdrn --part1_fd.a0e5df7.289d9a0c_boundary-- From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Sat Aug 4 19:41:57 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com) Date: Sat, 4 Aug 2001 14:41:57 EDT Subject: [303rd-Talk] KLM 007 for Bill Heller Message-ID: --part1_ab.d45be7b.289d9bf5_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dear Bill Heller, Thank you for your input on Korean Airlines and the lost flight. My wife and I flew with a Korean Air flight in 1984 to Seoul and I remember rather vividly about the errant flight KL007 and often wondered if it was "merely" pilot or navigation error or what?? Bob Finley --part1_ab.d45be7b.289d9bf5_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dear Bill Heller, Thank you for your input on Korean Airlines and the lost
flight. My wife and I flew with a Korean Air flight in 1984 to Seoul and I
remember rather vividly
about the errant flight KL007 and often wondered if it was "merely" pilot or
navigation error or what??                                              Bob
Finley --part1_ab.d45be7b.289d9bf5_boundary-- From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Sat Aug 4 20:52:59 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Kevin Pearson) Date: Sat, 04 Aug 2001 14:52:59 -0500 Subject: [303rd-Talk] CCRC Message-ID: Jack Rencher: Wasn't the Aquatania one of two sister ships to the Lusitania? I have heard that at the outbreak of the war, the luxury cruise liners like Queen Mary and all the others were converted to troop ships and that they were stripped of their fine accomodations so more troops could be carried. What was you experience on the Aquatania? Was is adequately comfortable, the food good, or was it just miseably crowded with seasick GIs? Very interesting about your Gee training. You were a pilot, right? And wasn't Gee operated by Navigators? Please excuse this what might appear to be a stupid question, but why were you trained on Gee if you were a pilot. Did the Pilot and Navigator operate the system together? Sorry, but Navigational aids are not my forte. Thanks for your comments! Kevin >From: Jprencher@aol.com >Reply-To: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com >To: 303rd-talk@303rdbga.com >Subject: Re: [303rd-Talk] CCRC >Date: Sat, 4 Aug 2001 01:34:10 EDT > >Kevin, Our crew did not fly a plane to England. We went over on an English >ship, The Aquatania as I remember. Our first assignment was at an airport >just on the edge of London. I don't remember the name of it. The Pilots and >Navigator were there. I don't remember where the rest of the crew went. We >were there about 2 or 3 weeks and studied the Gee Box. It was the first I >had >ever heard of it. It proved to be a life saver to us several times. I have >used it few times to land when it was absolutely Zero Zero. Once when we >got >on the ground and stopped we opened the pilots window and stuck our head >out >and could not see the ground with a flash light and it was daytime. Not >night. After we finished there our crew was reunited and we were assigned >to >Molesworth. It was a lucky assignment. The 303rd was certainly one of the >better and probably the best Bomb Group in the 8th Air Force. Another bit >of >luck. I was trained to be a P38 pilot. I didn't like it when they put me in >B17s but I learned to love them. I probably would not have lived through >the >war if I had stayed in fighters. > Best Wishes, >Jack Rencher > Box 7927 > Boise, Idaho 83707 > _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Sat Aug 4 20:57:03 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Kevin Pearson) Date: Sat, 04 Aug 2001 14:57:03 -0500 Subject: [303rd-Talk] Fw: Geezers Message-ID: Good stuff! I'm using it in my next newsletter! Thanks, Bill! Kevin >From: "Bill Owen" >Reply-To: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com >To: <303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com> >Subject: [303rd-Talk] Fw: Geezers >Date: Fri, 3 Aug 2001 20:24:20 -0500 > >To all the Old Geezers of the 303rd--I'm not quite as old as you who served >in the 303rd, but I am of the same generation. This was sent to me and I >saw >a lot of truth in it. Maybe some of you Old Geezers will enjoy it. > Cheers , Bill Owen > > > Subject: Geezers > > > > "OLD GEEZERS" > > > "Geezers" are easy to spot; this is slang for an old man. But, at > > > sporting events, during the playing of the National Anthem, they > > > hold their caps over their hearts and sing without embarrassment. > > > They know the words and believe in them. > > > They remember World War I, the Depression, World War II, Pearl > > > Harbor, Guadalcanal, Normandy and Hitler. They remember the > > > Atomic Age, the Korean War, The Cold War, the Jet Age and the > > > Moon Landing, not to mention Vietnam. > > > If you bump into a "Geezer" on the sidewalk, he'll apologize; pass > > > a Geezer on the street, he'll nod, or tip his cap to a lady. > > > "Geezers" trust strangers and are courtly to women. They hold the > > > door for the next person and always when walking, make sure the > > > lady is on the inside for protection. > > > "Geezers" get embarrassed if someone curses in front of women > > > and children and they don't like violence and filth on TV and in >movies. > > > Geezers have moral courage. > > > Geezers seldom brag unless it's about the grandchildren in Little > > > League or music recitals. > > > This country needs "Geezers" with their decent values and common > > > sense. We need them now more than ever. It's the "Geezers" who > > > know our great country is protected, not by politicians or police, but > > > by the young men and women in the military serving their country in > > > foreign lands, just as they did, without a thought except to do a good > > > job, the best you can, and to get home to loved ones. > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Sat Aug 4 21:06:09 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Kevin Pearson) Date: Sat, 04 Aug 2001 15:06:09 -0500 Subject: [303rd-Talk] The Moleworth tape Message-ID: Hi Lloyd: I was speaking to Leslie Giddins the other day at a meeting, found out he was a 303rdster, and mentioned your tape that was circulating around. His eyes widened, and he asked me if there was any way I could get a copy to circulate to the three 303rd BG(H) members that are with our Missouri Chapter/St. Louis Wing of the 8th AFHS. I'm attaching the names and addresses of the three in the event the 303rd BGA does not have them as members. If you do have a spare, send it to me and I will prepare envelopes, labels and postage so that all they have to do is watch the tape and send it on. Thanks, Lloyd! Kevin Pearson, 2514 W. Woodland, St. Joseph, MO 64506. Leslie W. Giddings 915 S.E. 5th St. Lee's Summitt, MO 64063 303 BG Harry H. Schulz 9748 MacKenzie Rd. St. Louis, MO 63123-5400 303 BG John A. Thurmon Box 30B Wellington, MO 64097 303 BG >From: "Lloyd J Grant" >Reply-To: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com >To: <303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com> >Subject: [303rd-Talk] The Moleworth tape >Date: Fri, 3 Aug 2001 16:44:50 -0400 > >To all: > >The tape originally provided by Don Kehne, which might have been more >suitably titled, " The Kellog Tape" has now run the course. I would like >to >thank everyone who participated and contributed to the distribution of the >tape. As far as I am concerned, it was worth the effort if it brought any >satisfaction at all to those who viewed it. > >Special thanks to Don Kehne ( who provided the tape originally), Harry >Goebrecht ( who provided an explaination of the various scenes), Bill >Jones >( who took the time to research the tape and share his information), to >Bill >Owens ( who indentified the various aircraft and serial numbers) , Gary >Moncur for providing extra copies ( which I gave away to other members), >Anne Grant for relaying messages to the Group while I was absent, to >Maurice Paulk for providing a copy to the Florida members ( I still have >your copy, pard ), to Donna Morrows for paying the extra postage to get a >copy to Robin Beeby in the UK ( one of Garys'), and to everyone for the >solidarity and comradery expressed when I went TDY away from the forum. > >Hopefully, I will be a mellower feller now that I am back, but I recommend >you keep on good terms with your parachute riggers, none-the-less. I >missed you all; and that's no embellishment of the truth. > >Thank you. > >Lloyd. > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Sat Aug 4 22:20:34 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com) Date: Sat, 4 Aug 2001 17:20:34 EDT Subject: [303rd-Talk] Re: 303rd-Talk digest, Vol 1 #349 - 30 msgs Message-ID: <7a.18b7d07f.289dc122@aol.com> --part1_7a.18b7d07f.289dc122_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Gary, I did receive the above subject. I live ten miles East of Rochester, NY. The text was large size and all ran together. Towards the end of the forum the text seemed to be back to normal. Info for you. Bob --part1_7a.18b7d07f.289dc122_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Gary,
I did receive the above subject. I live ten miles East of Rochester, NY. The
text was large size and all ran together. Towards the end of the forum the
text seemed to be back to normal. Info for you.
Bob --part1_7a.18b7d07f.289dc122_boundary-- From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Sat Aug 4 22:38:13 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Lloyd J Grant) Date: Sat, 4 Aug 2001 17:38:13 -0400 Subject: [303rd-Talk] The Moleworth tape References: Message-ID: <001101c11d2d$c5ca7c40$12904d0c@o3n4f8> Kevin, its' good to hear from you. As you may know, I have been away from the 303rd forum for a while. I was kind of hoping that the Molesworth Kellog tape) had about run the gamut of interested parties, but the purpose was essentially to get some people to come out of the woodwork, and it would be hard, if not impossible, to deny the tape to anyone who would like to see it. There were four copies in circulation. One is in Hawaii with Jim Walling, one is in England with Robin Beeby (303rd UK contact), Gordy Alton should have or is about to recieve a copy, and I have a copy on my desk that Maurice Paulk donated to the Florida contingent. I will send you the copy I have and let you distribute it to interested parties in MO. I would like to get it back, as, believe it or not , I have only viewed the tape once myself. I learned alot from the folks that watched the tape, hopefully made some new friends in the process, and despite some logistics hassles, generally feel the whole project was worth while. I will let you know when the tape has been sent to you. Best regards, Kevin. Lloyd. ps. I am forwarding comments from Harry Goebrecht, Bill Jones, and Bill Owens that will help explain the scenes. There is no sound track, but it is in color. lg. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kevin Pearson" To: <303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com> Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2001 4:06 PM Subject: Re: [303rd-Talk] The Moleworth tape > Hi Lloyd: I was speaking to Leslie Giddins the other day at a meeting, > found out he was a 303rdster, and mentioned your tape that was circulating > around. His eyes widened, and he asked me if there was any way I could get > a copy to circulate to the three 303rd BG(H) members that are with our > Missouri Chapter/St. Louis Wing of the 8th AFHS. I'm attaching the names > and addresses of the three in the event the 303rd BGA does not have them as > members. If you do have a spare, send it to me and I will prepare > envelopes, labels and postage so that all they have to do is watch the tape > and send it on. Thanks, Lloyd! Kevin Pearson, 2514 W. Woodland, St. > Joseph, MO 64506. > > Leslie W. Giddings 915 S.E. 5th St. Lee's Summitt, MO 64063 303 BG > Harry H. Schulz 9748 MacKenzie Rd. St. Louis, MO 63123-5400 303 BG > John A. Thurmon Box 30B Wellington, MO 64097 303 BG > > > > >From: "Lloyd J Grant" > >Reply-To: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com > >To: <303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com> > >Subject: [303rd-Talk] The Moleworth tape > >Date: Fri, 3 Aug 2001 16:44:50 -0400 > > > >To all: > > > >The tape originally provided by Don Kehne, which might have been more > >suitably titled, " The Kellog Tape" has now run the course. I would like > >to > >thank everyone who participated and contributed to the distribution of the > >tape. As far as I am concerned, it was worth the effort if it brought any > >satisfaction at all to those who viewed it. > > > >Special thanks to Don Kehne ( who provided the tape originally), Harry > >Goebrecht ( who provided an explaination of the various scenes), Bill > >Jones > >( who took the time to research the tape and share his information), to > >Bill > >Owens ( who indentified the various aircraft and serial numbers) , Gary > >Moncur for providing extra copies ( which I gave away to other members), > >Anne Grant for relaying messages to the Group while I was absent, to > >Maurice Paulk for providing a copy to the Florida members ( I still have > >your copy, pard ), to Donna Morrows for paying the extra postage to get a > >copy to Robin Beeby in the UK ( one of Garys'), and to everyone for the > >solidarity and comradery expressed when I went TDY away from the forum. > > > >Hopefully, I will be a mellower feller now that I am back, but I recommend > >you keep on good terms with your parachute riggers, none-the-less. I > >missed you all; and that's no embellishment of the truth. > > > >Thank you. > > > >Lloyd. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp > > > From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Sat Aug 4 22:54:37 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Lloyd J Grant) Date: Sat, 4 Aug 2001 17:54:37 -0400 Subject: [303rd-Talk] The Moleworth tape References: Message-ID: <003801c11d30$11813280$12904d0c@o3n4f8> Kevin Pearson, I have lost your current e-mail address. Contact me at palidin@worldnet.att.net if you would like me to forward the previously described information, re: the Molesworth tape. Lloyd. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kevin Pearson" To: <303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com> Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2001 4:06 PM Subject: Re: [303rd-Talk] The Moleworth tape > Hi Lloyd: I was speaking to Leslie Giddins the other day at a meeting, > found out he was a 303rdster, and mentioned your tape that was circulating > around. His eyes widened, and he asked me if there was any way I could get > a copy to circulate to the three 303rd BG(H) members that are with our > Missouri Chapter/St. Louis Wing of the 8th AFHS. I'm attaching the names > and addresses of the three in the event the 303rd BGA does not have them as > members. If you do have a spare, send it to me and I will prepare > envelopes, labels and postage so that all they have to do is watch the tape > and send it on. Thanks, Lloyd! Kevin Pearson, 2514 W. Woodland, St. > Joseph, MO 64506. > > Leslie W. Giddings 915 S.E. 5th St. Lee's Summitt, MO 64063 303 BG > Harry H. Schulz 9748 MacKenzie Rd. St. Louis, MO 63123-5400 303 BG > John A. Thurmon Box 30B Wellington, MO 64097 303 BG > > > > >From: "Lloyd J Grant" > >Reply-To: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com > >To: <303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com> > >Subject: [303rd-Talk] The Moleworth tape > >Date: Fri, 3 Aug 2001 16:44:50 -0400 > > > >To all: > > > >The tape originally provided by Don Kehne, which might have been more > >suitably titled, " The Kellog Tape" has now run the course. I would like > >to > >thank everyone who participated and contributed to the distribution of the > >tape. As far as I am concerned, it was worth the effort if it brought any > >satisfaction at all to those who viewed it. > > > >Special thanks to Don Kehne ( who provided the tape originally), Harry > >Goebrecht ( who provided an explaination of the various scenes), Bill > >Jones > >( who took the time to research the tape and share his information), to > >Bill > >Owens ( who indentified the various aircraft and serial numbers) , Gary > >Moncur for providing extra copies ( which I gave away to other members), > >Anne Grant for relaying messages to the Group while I was absent, to > >Maurice Paulk for providing a copy to the Florida members ( I still have > >your copy, pard ), to Donna Morrows for paying the extra postage to get a > >copy to Robin Beeby in the UK ( one of Garys'), and to everyone for the > >solidarity and comradery expressed when I went TDY away from the forum. > > > >Hopefully, I will be a mellower feller now that I am back, but I recommend > >you keep on good terms with your parachute riggers, none-the-less. I > >missed you all; and that's no embellishment of the truth. > > > >Thank you. > > > >Lloyd. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp > > > From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Sun Aug 5 03:14:18 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com) Date: Sat, 4 Aug 2001 22:14:18 EDT Subject: [303rd-Talk] Re: 303rd-Talk digest, Vol 1 #348 - 29 msgs Message-ID: <11f.2af86e3.289e05fa@aol.com> I got it in Milwaukee From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Sun Aug 5 06:06:38 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com) Date: Sun, 5 Aug 2001 01:06:38 EDT Subject: [303rd-Talk] CCRC Message-ID: <73.10fa1552.289e2e5e@aol.com> Kevin, The Aquatania as I remember was next in size to the 2 Queens. We had an all English crew and I think 16,000 American troops aboard, so it was crowded. We ate 2 meals per day and I think there was a chow line around the clock. I thought the food was adequate but naturally nothing fancy. The officers had the upper decks and I was in a state room with 11 others. There was a head between our state room and the one next door which we shared. Spike Jones and his city slickers were in the next one going over to entertain the troops so we had Music? as they rehearsed a lot Our enlisted men were in the lower decks and in hammocks and bunks that were a lot more crowded. Our crew was very near the propeller shafts and rudder so it creaked every time they turned a bit. We went alone not in a convoy as our ship was faster than any submarine in the world so no one could stock us They could have got ahead of us and got us as we went by so we changed course every 5 minutes or so. It took us about 5 days to make the crossing. I was one of the 16 or so of us that drew a 4 hour watch every 12 hours. my station was starboard side of the bridge about 60 feet above the water. Sometimes it was so foggy I couldn't see the water but on the trip I did spot one submarine which turned out to be a whale. I also spotted a convoy of ships which turned out to be a bunch of rocks on the coast of Ireland. I was a pilot, copilot navigator and have an FAA A&E aircraft mechanics license. It's a good thing I was a navigator as our Navigator couldn't read a map flying along the coast at 1000 feet in CAVU weather. He never knew where we were unless I told him and then he would be lost again in the next 10 miles. He was good on the gee box. He and I worked out a blind landing system with it that we could and did several time use it to land at Molesworth in Zero Zero conditions. It wasn't a one man operation. He ran the g box and I ran the airplane and the engineer called out the airspeed and the rest of the crew prayed We hit the runway every time but had one H--- of a time taxing to the parking area as the Gee didn't work when we were on the ground. One time the engineering officer who was not a pilot went up on a test flight with us acting as copilot. when we touched down I bounced about 6 bounces before it finally stayed on the ground. He was very nervous and started counting the bounces, one two three four. I told him he just as well quit counting I was not about to go around I just read your letter again to see if I answered all your questions. I don't think there were many sick GIs. The ship was so big it didn't rock much. There was no rough seas on our trip. It was very crowed but other than that not uncomfortable. Jack Rencher Box 7927 Boise ID 83707 That's Idaho "Home of the good potatoes" From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Sun Aug 5 07:37:48 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Chuck Golden) Date: Sat, 4 Aug 2001 23:37:48 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [303rd-Talk] The Tape Message-ID: <20010805063748.61142.qmail@web13808.mail.yahoo.com> Greetings from Germany. I have watched with rapt amazement as the tapes have wound their ways all over, and now that it seems that they have run their course through the hands of the original fliers I'd be honored to see it for myself. If possible, could one of you mail a copy to me? I'll return it when finished with a postage refund. Many thanks. Chuck Golden HQ EUCOM CMR 480 BOX 832 APO AE 09128 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger http://phonecard.yahoo.com/ From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Sun Aug 5 13:16:59 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Jim Walling) Date: Sun, 05 Aug 2001 02:16:59 -1000 Subject: [303rd-Talk] CCRC In-Reply-To: <73.10fa1552.289e2e5e@aol.com> Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.20010805021659.008f6a80@ilhawaii.net> Jack and Kevin, Our crew went over on the Ile de France in late October or early November, 1944. We also had an English crew and the food was terrible. After the first day I survived on cookies and candy bars frim the PX. I was on D deck and the bunk/hammocks were stacked four high. We were not in convoy either and apparently one submarine was spotted and in running from it we went south into some hot, bad weather. Seems like half of those on board were sick and were throwing up spaghetti all over the place. I guess I did not have enough in my stomach to get sick, but the smell almost did me in. When we completed our missions in late March of 1945 we returned to the US in a liberty ship in convoy and the trip took about ten days. Jim walling At 01:06 AM 8/5/01 EDT, you wrote: >Kevin, The Aquatania as I remember was next in size to the 2 Queens. We had >an all English crew and I think 16,000 American troops aboard, so it was >crowded. We ate 2 meals per day and I think there was a chow line around the >clock. I thought the food was adequate but naturally nothing fancy. The >officers had the upper decks and I was in a state room with 11 others. From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Sun Aug 5 15:55:00 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Lloyd J Grant) Date: Sun, 5 Aug 2001 10:55:00 -0400 Subject: [303rd-Talk] The Tape References: <20010805063748.61142.qmail@web13808.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <001701c11dbe$9bc427c0$0f8f4d0c@o3n4f8> Chuck Golden, I will first ask Robin Beeby if he has the where-with-all to get a copy over to you, failing that, we will work out some arrangement for you to see it. You can contact me via e-mail here: palidin@worldnet.att.net and we can coordinate getting the tape to you without having to post correspondence to the forum. Where is HQ EUCOM located , incidently? I was stationed at USAEUR&7th Army HQ in Heidelberg back in 71-72. I reckon the tape hasn't quite run the gamut after all. Anyone else want to see it? Last chance for the romance, so don't be shy about piping up, okay? Someone suggested sending a copy to the PX. Is this a viable idea? Best to all. Lloyd. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chuck Golden" To: <303rd-Talk@303rdBGA.com> Sent: Sunday, August 05, 2001 2:37 AM Subject: [303rd-Talk] The Tape > Greetings from Germany. I have watched with rapt > amazement as the tapes have wound their ways all over, > and now that it seems that they have run their course > through the hands of the original fliers I'd be > honored to see it for myself. If possible, could one > of you mail a copy to me? I'll return it when > finished with a postage refund. Many thanks. > > Chuck Golden > HQ EUCOM > CMR 480 BOX 832 > APO AE 09128 > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger > http://phonecard.yahoo.com/ > > From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Sun Aug 5 21:09:10 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com) Date: Sun, 5 Aug 2001 16:09:10 EDT Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems Message-ID: <3e.f78d684.289f01e6@aol.com> Hi Gordy: Frankly, we had a home that we loved in Florida...completely adequate, on a lake, nice neighbors, etc., etc., but too damned expensive for usn's who can't retire and are virtually unemployable. My design service has given way to every "artist" with a computer and Nyela's office skills always seem to be replaced by somebody who works for half and produces a fifth of what she did. As they say, this is a fabulous country, but don't get sick and don't get old! Anyway, we're "regrouping" at the home of Nyela's daughter, a newly built giant of a house with us in the huge (2000 sq.ft.) basement area complete with huge Jacuzzi. With our furniture installed and the pictures hung, you'd think we always lived here. Some wonderful people involved here, you can bet. Also, dear old Boynton is bustin' at the seams....incredible. Good to hear from you, and we send our very best.......Cheers, Bob and Nyela From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Sun Aug 5 21:48:09 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Dick Smith) Date: Sun, 5 Aug 2001 13:48:09 -0700 Subject: [303rd-Talk] The Tape References: <20010805063748.61142.qmail@web13808.mail.yahoo.com> <001701c11dbe$9bc427c0$0f8f4d0c@o3n4f8> Message-ID: <000901c11def$f070d440$59f833cf@richards> Hi : A copy to the PX is a Great idea they could get it copied and sell it to the members. Spider ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lloyd J Grant" To: <303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com> Sent: Sunday, August 05, 2001 7:55 AM Subject: Re: [303rd-Talk] The Tape > Chuck Golden, I will first ask Robin Beeby if he has the where-with-all to > get a copy over to you, failing that, we will work out some arrangement for > you to see it. You can contact me via e-mail here: palidin@worldnet.att.net > and we can coordinate getting the tape to you without having to post > correspondence to the forum. > > Where is HQ EUCOM located , incidently? I was stationed at USAEUR&7th Army > HQ in Heidelberg back in 71-72. > > I reckon the tape hasn't quite run the gamut after all. Anyone else want to > see it? Last chance for the romance, so don't be shy about piping up, okay? > > Someone suggested sending a copy to the PX. Is this a viable idea? > > Best to all. > Lloyd. > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Chuck Golden" > To: <303rd-Talk@303rdBGA.com> > Sent: Sunday, August 05, 2001 2:37 AM > Subject: [303rd-Talk] The Tape > > > > Greetings from Germany. I have watched with rapt > > amazement as the tapes have wound their ways all over, > > and now that it seems that they have run their course > > through the hands of the original fliers I'd be > > honored to see it for myself. If possible, could one > > of you mail a copy to me? I'll return it when > > finished with a postage refund. Many thanks. > > > > Chuck Golden > > HQ EUCOM > > CMR 480 BOX 832 > > APO AE 09128 > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger > > http://phonecard.yahoo.com/ > > > > > From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Mon Aug 6 00:46:41 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Sean Reid) Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 00:46:41 +0100 Subject: [303rd-Talk] Newbie Message-ID: <000401c11e09$1020ab80$5a51883e@seanreid> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0020_01C11E11.41D5EA20 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi All...Just to introduce myself.....36 years old,live in North = Wales,U.K and am a participant in a B17 flight sim campaign(v8th = ops).Have an interest in the 8th Air Force thanks to my late father(He = had over 300 booksbefore we were forced to sell them)...He used to take = me to wreck sites...often on evocative,moody,misty hills...and at times = you could almost hear the ghostly hum of a 17 as She flew over head.My = father was a member of 8th AF Historical Society,FOTE and a friend of = Sally-B...spent many of his holidays visiting old bases and prior to his = death was intending to write a book on all the memorials to the eigth in = Britain....... ------=_NextPart_000_0020_01C11E11.41D5EA20 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi All...Just to introduce = myself.....36 years=20 old,live in North Wales,U.K and am a participant in a B17 flight sim=20 campaign(v8th ops).Have an interest in the 8th Air Force thanks to = my late=20 father(He had over 300 booksbefore we were forced to sell them)...He = used to=20 take me to wreck sites...often on evocative,moody,misty hills...and at = times you=20 could almost hear the ghostly hum of a 17 as She flew over head.My = father was a=20 member of 8th AF Historical Society,FOTE and a friend of Sally-B...spent = many of=20 his holidays visiting old bases and prior to his death was intending to = write a=20 book on all the memorials to the eigth in=20 Britain.......

------=_NextPart_000_0020_01C11E11.41D5EA20-- From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Mon Aug 6 00:53:45 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (george frecther) Date: Sun, 5 Aug 2001 19:53:45 -0400 Subject: [303rd-Talk] The Tape References: <20010805063748.61142.qmail@web13808.mail.yahoo.com> <001701c11dbe$9bc427c0$0f8f4d0c@o3n4f8> Message-ID: <005301c11e09$dd58ae40$208aa818@nj.rr.com> Being fairly to this organization, I am unfamiliar with what the tape is. Iflew with the 427th fromJan 1944 to May 1944 as a navigator with the Melton crew. May I have one answer as to what the tape pictures to see if I want to look at it. Thanks George(Harry) Frechter ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lloyd J Grant" To: <303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com> Sent: Sunday, August 05, 2001 10:55 AM Subject: Re: [303rd-Talk] The Tape > Chuck Golden, I will first ask Robin Beeby if he has the where-with-all to > get a copy over to you, failing that, we will work out some arrangement for > you to see it. You can contact me via e-mail here: palidin@worldnet.att.net > and we can coordinate getting the tape to you without having to post > correspondence to the forum. > > Where is HQ EUCOM located , incidently? I was stationed at USAEUR&7th Army > HQ in Heidelberg back in 71-72. > > I reckon the tape hasn't quite run the gamut after all. Anyone else want to > see it? Last chance for the romance, so don't be shy about piping up, okay? > > Someone suggested sending a copy to the PX. Is this a viable idea? > > Best to all. > Lloyd. > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Chuck Golden" > To: <303rd-Talk@303rdBGA.com> > Sent: Sunday, August 05, 2001 2:37 AM > Subject: [303rd-Talk] The Tape > > > > Greetings from Germany. I have watched with rapt > > amazement as the tapes have wound their ways all over, > > and now that it seems that they have run their course > > through the hands of the original fliers I'd be > > honored to see it for myself. If possible, could one > > of you mail a copy to me? I'll return it when > > finished with a postage refund. Many thanks. > > > > Chuck Golden > > HQ EUCOM > > CMR 480 BOX 832 > > APO AE 09128 > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger > > http://phonecard.yahoo.com/ > > > > > > From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Mon Aug 6 01:48:25 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Lloyd J Grant) Date: Sun, 5 Aug 2001 20:48:25 -0400 Subject: [303rd-Talk] The Tape References: <20010805063748.61142.qmail@web13808.mail.yahoo.com> <001701c11dbe$9bc427c0$0f8f4d0c@o3n4f8> <005301c11e09$dd58ae40$208aa818@nj.rr.com> Message-ID: <001101c11e11$817cc680$3e904d0c@o3n4f8> George Frechter, stand by, sir. I will forward some information about the tape. You may wish to contact some of the members of the forum who have viewed it. Once the tape was sent, I erased the respondents info from my list, thus I cannot help you in that respect. Whether the video will be germaine to your remembrance would best be answered by those who have seen the tape. Perhaps someone here will respond. If you want to see the tape, I will make sure that you do. That was the whole purpose of offering it in the first place. very best regards, Lloyd Grant. ----- Original Message ----- From: "george frecther" To: <303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com> Sent: Sunday, August 05, 2001 7:53 PM Subject: Re: [303rd-Talk] The Tape > Being fairly to this organization, I am unfamiliar with what the tape is. > Iflew with the 427th fromJan 1944 to May 1944 as a navigator with the Melton > crew. > May I have one answer as to what the tape pictures to see if I want to look > at it. > Thanks > > George(Harry) Frechter > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Lloyd J Grant" > To: <303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com> > Sent: Sunday, August 05, 2001 10:55 AM > Subject: Re: [303rd-Talk] The Tape > > > > Chuck Golden, I will first ask Robin Beeby if he has the where-with-all > to > > get a copy over to you, failing that, we will work out some arrangement > for > > you to see it. You can contact me via e-mail here: > palidin@worldnet.att.net > > and we can coordinate getting the tape to you without having to post > > correspondence to the forum. > > > > Where is HQ EUCOM located , incidently? I was stationed at USAEUR&7th Army > > HQ in Heidelberg back in 71-72. > > > > I reckon the tape hasn't quite run the gamut after all. Anyone else want > to > > see it? Last chance for the romance, so don't be shy about piping up, > okay? > > > > Someone suggested sending a copy to the PX. Is this a viable idea? > > > > Best to all. > > Lloyd. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Chuck Golden" > > To: <303rd-Talk@303rdBGA.com> > > Sent: Sunday, August 05, 2001 2:37 AM > > Subject: [303rd-Talk] The Tape > > > > > > > Greetings from Germany. I have watched with rapt > > > amazement as the tapes have wound their ways all over, > > > and now that it seems that they have run their course > > > through the hands of the original fliers I'd be > > > honored to see it for myself. If possible, could one > > > of you mail a copy to me? I'll return it when > > > finished with a postage refund. Many thanks. > > > > > > Chuck Golden > > > HQ EUCOM > > > CMR 480 BOX 832 > > > APO AE 09128 > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > > Do You Yahoo!? > > > Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger > > > http://phonecard.yahoo.com/ > > > > > > > > > > > > From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Mon Aug 6 02:19:46 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Lloyd J Grant) Date: Sun, 5 Aug 2001 21:19:46 -0400 Subject: [303rd-Talk] The Tape References: <20010805063748.61142.qmail@web13808.mail.yahoo.com> <001701c11dbe$9bc427c0$0f8f4d0c@o3n4f8> <005301c11e09$dd58ae40$208aa818@nj.rr.com> Message-ID: <003401c11e15$e434da20$3e904d0c@o3n4f8> George, please contact me here: palidin@worldnet.att.net. I need your e-mail address in order to forward the synopsis of the tape. Thanks, Lloyd. ----- Original Message ----- From: "george frecther" To: <303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com> Sent: Sunday, August 05, 2001 7:53 PM Subject: Re: [303rd-Talk] The Tape > Being fairly to this organization, I am unfamiliar with what the tape is. > Iflew with the 427th fromJan 1944 to May 1944 as a navigator with the Melton > crew. > May I have one answer as to what the tape pictures to see if I want to look > at it. > Thanks > > George(Harry) Frechter > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Lloyd J Grant" > To: <303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com> > Sent: Sunday, August 05, 2001 10:55 AM > Subject: Re: [303rd-Talk] The Tape > > > > Chuck Golden, I will first ask Robin Beeby if he has the where-with-all > to > > get a copy over to you, failing that, we will work out some arrangement > for > > you to see it. You can contact me via e-mail here: > palidin@worldnet.att.net > > and we can coordinate getting the tape to you without having to post > > correspondence to the forum. > > > > Where is HQ EUCOM located , incidently? I was stationed at USAEUR&7th Army > > HQ in Heidelberg back in 71-72. > > > > I reckon the tape hasn't quite run the gamut after all. Anyone else want > to > > see it? Last chance for the romance, so don't be shy about piping up, > okay? > > > > Someone suggested sending a copy to the PX. Is this a viable idea? > > > > Best to all. > > Lloyd. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Chuck Golden" > > To: <303rd-Talk@303rdBGA.com> > > Sent: Sunday, August 05, 2001 2:37 AM > > Subject: [303rd-Talk] The Tape > > > > > > > Greetings from Germany. I have watched with rapt > > > amazement as the tapes have wound their ways all over, > > > and now that it seems that they have run their course > > > through the hands of the original fliers I'd be > > > honored to see it for myself. If possible, could one > > > of you mail a copy to me? I'll return it when > > > finished with a postage refund. Many thanks. > > > > > > Chuck Golden > > > HQ EUCOM > > > CMR 480 BOX 832 > > > APO AE 09128 > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > > Do You Yahoo!? > > > Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger > > > http://phonecard.yahoo.com/ > > > > > > > > > > > > From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Mon Aug 6 02:47:57 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Lloyd J Grant) Date: Sun, 5 Aug 2001 21:47:57 -0400 Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems References: <3e.f78d684.289f01e6@aol.com> Message-ID: <004601c11e19$d26a92e0$3e904d0c@o3n4f8> Too young to give up, too old to be considered, and still tough enough to go on. Well, "Semper Fi", Bob.( as the Marines say). Very best to you, sir. Lloyd. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: <303rd-talk@303rdbga.com> Sent: Sunday, August 05, 2001 4:09 PM Subject: Re: [303rd-Talk] list problems > Hi Gordy: Frankly, we had a home that we loved in Florida...completely > adequate, on a lake, nice neighbors, etc., etc., but too damned expensive for > usn's who can't retire and are virtually unemployable. My design service has > given way to every "artist" with a computer and Nyela's office skills always > seem to be replaced by somebody who works for half and produces a fifth of > what she did. As they say, this is a fabulous country, but don't get sick > and don't get old! Anyway, we're "regrouping" at the home of Nyela's > daughter, a newly built giant of a house with us in the huge (2000 sq.ft.) > basement area complete with huge Jacuzzi. With our furniture installed and > the pictures hung, you'd think we always lived here. Some wonderful people > involved here, you can bet. Also, dear old Boynton is bustin' at the > seams....incredible. > Good to hear from you, and we send our very best.......Cheers, Bob and Nyela > > From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Mon Aug 6 04:57:29 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Gordon Alton) Date: Sun, 5 Aug 2001 20:57:29 -0700 Subject: [303rd-Talk] list problems References: <3e.f78d684.289f01e6@aol.com> <004601c11e19$d26a92e0$3e904d0c@o3n4f8> Message-ID: <004b01c11e2b$ea24ecc0$c209f4cc@e0y0k4> My feelings, exactly, Lloyd. How are book sales lately, Bob? I have mentioned to a few people how good the book is. I don't think a person can find one that is better illustrated, and with such good photos. I am glad you like your new place. On another subject, re: the Molesworth tape. I haven't had a chance to view mine yet, as I am in the middle of moving this weekend, and my VCR is packed away. Do you need me to send it to anyone, Lloyd, or are we OK without it for now? Gordy. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lloyd J Grant" To: <303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com> Sent: Sunday, August 05, 2001 6:47 PM Subject: Re: [303rd-Talk] list problems > Too young to give up, too old to be considered, and still tough enough to > go on. Well, "Semper Fi", Bob.( as the Marines say). Very best to you, > sir. > > Lloyd. > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: <303rd-talk@303rdbga.com> > Sent: Sunday, August 05, 2001 4:09 PM > Subject: Re: [303rd-Talk] list problems > > > > Hi Gordy: Frankly, we had a home that we loved in Florida...completely > > adequate, on a lake, nice neighbors, etc., etc., but too damned expensive > for > > usn's who can't retire and are virtually unemployable. My design service > has > > given way to every "artist" with a computer and Nyela's office skills > always > > seem to be replaced by somebody who works for half and produces a fifth of > > what she did. As they say, this is a fabulous country, but don't get sick > > and don't get old! Anyway, we're "regrouping" at the home of Nyela's > > daughter, a newly built giant of a house with us in the huge (2000 sq.ft.) > > basement area complete with huge Jacuzzi. With our furniture installed > and > > the pictures hung, you'd think we always lived here. Some wonderful > people > > involved here, you can bet. Also, dear old Boynton is bustin' at the > > seams....incredible. > > Good to hear from you, and we send our very best.......Cheers, Bob and > Nyela > > > > > From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Mon Aug 6 14:25:50 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Kevin Pearson) Date: Mon, 06 Aug 2001 08:25:50 -0500 Subject: [303rd-Talk] The Moleworth tape Message-ID: Thanks, Lloyd, you're a good man. The 303rdsters here in Missouri really want to see some footage they have not seen before. I will look forward to your messagen that the tape is on the way. Kevin >From: "Lloyd J Grant" >Reply-To: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com >To: <303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com> >Subject: Re: [303rd-Talk] The Moleworth tape >Date: Sat, 4 Aug 2001 17:38:13 -0400 > >Kevin, its' good to hear from you. As you may know, I have been away from >the 303rd forum for a while. I was kind of hoping that the Molesworth > Kellog tape) had about run the gamut of interested parties, but the >purpose was essentially to get some people to come out of the woodwork, and >it would be hard, if not impossible, to deny the tape to anyone who would >like to see it. There were four copies in circulation. One is in Hawaii >with Jim Walling, one is in England with Robin Beeby (303rd UK contact), >Gordy Alton should have or is about to recieve a copy, and I have a copy >on >my desk that Maurice Paulk donated to the Florida contingent. I will send >you the copy I have and let you distribute it to interested parties in MO. >I would like to get it back, as, believe it or not , I have only viewed the >tape once myself. I learned alot from the folks that watched the tape, >hopefully made some new friends in the process, and despite some logistics >hassles, generally feel the whole project was worth while. I will let you >know when the tape has been sent to you. > >Best regards, Kevin. > >Lloyd. > >ps. I am forwarding comments from Harry Goebrecht, Bill Jones, and Bill >Owens that will help explain the scenes. There is no sound track, but it >is >in color. lg. > > > > > > > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Kevin Pearson" >To: <303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com> >Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2001 4:06 PM >Subject: Re: [303rd-Talk] The Moleworth tape > > > > Hi Lloyd: I was speaking to Leslie Giddins the other day at a meeting, > > found out he was a 303rdster, and mentioned your tape that was >circulating > > around. His eyes widened, and he asked me if there was any way I could >get > > a copy to circulate to the three 303rd BG(H) members that are with our > > Missouri Chapter/St. Louis Wing of the 8th AFHS. I'm attaching the >names > > and addresses of the three in the event the 303rd BGA does not have them >as > > members. If you do have a spare, send it to me and I will prepare > > envelopes, labels and postage so that all they have to do is watch the >tape > > and send it on. Thanks, Lloyd! Kevin Pearson, 2514 W. Woodland, St. > > Joseph, MO 64506. > > > > Leslie W. Giddings 915 S.E. 5th St. Lee's Summitt, MO 64063 303 BG > > Harry H. Schulz 9748 MacKenzie Rd. St. Louis, MO 63123-5400 303 BG > > John A. Thurmon Box 30B Wellington, MO 64097 303 BG > > > > > > > > >From: "Lloyd J Grant" > > >Reply-To: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com > > >To: <303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com> > > >Subject: [303rd-Talk] The Moleworth tape > > >Date: Fri, 3 Aug 2001 16:44:50 -0400 > > > > > >To all: > > > > > >The tape originally provided by Don Kehne, which might have been more > > >suitably titled, " The Kellog Tape" has now run the course. I would >like > > >to > > >thank everyone who participated and contributed to the distribution of >the > > >tape. As far as I am concerned, it was worth the effort if it brought >any > > >satisfaction at all to those who viewed it. > > > > > >Special thanks to Don Kehne ( who provided the tape originally), Harry > > >Goebrecht ( who provided an explaination of the various scenes), Bill > > >Jones > > >( who took the time to research the tape and share his information), to > > >Bill > > >Owens ( who indentified the various aircraft and serial numbers) , Gary > > >Moncur for providing extra copies ( which I gave away to other >members), > > >Anne Grant for relaying messages to the Group while I was absent, to > > >Maurice Paulk for providing a copy to the Florida members ( I still >have > > >your copy, pard ), to Donna Morrows for paying the extra postage to get >a > > >copy to Robin Beeby in the UK ( one of Garys'), and to everyone for >the > > >solidarity and comradery expressed when I went TDY away from the forum. > > > > > >Hopefully, I will be a mellower feller now that I am back, but I >recommend > > >you keep on good terms with your parachute riggers, none-the-less. I > > >missed you all; and that's no embellishment of the truth. > > > > > >Thank you. > > > > > >Lloyd. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at >http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Mon Aug 6 14:27:45 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Kevin Pearson) Date: Mon, 06 Aug 2001 08:27:45 -0500 Subject: [303rd-Talk] The Moleworth tape Message-ID: Kevin M. Pearson St. Joseph Chamber of Commerce 3003 Frederick Ave. St. Joseph, MO 64506 I give you my work address so the tape does not end up a puddle of plastic goo in my outdoor mailbox at home. Close to 100 degree for the last three weeks! >From: "Lloyd J Grant" >Reply-To: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com >To: <303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com> >Subject: Re: [303rd-Talk] The Moleworth tape >Date: Sat, 4 Aug 2001 17:54:37 -0400 > >Kevin Pearson, I have lost your current e-mail address. Contact me at >palidin@worldnet.att.net if you would like me to forward the previously >described information, re: the Molesworth tape. > >Lloyd. > > > > > > > > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Kevin Pearson" >To: <303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com> >Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2001 4:06 PM >Subject: Re: [303rd-Talk] The Moleworth tape > > > > Hi Lloyd: I was speaking to Leslie Giddins the other day at a meeting, > > found out he was a 303rdster, and mentioned your tape that was >circulating > > around. His eyes widened, and he asked me if there was any way I could >get > > a copy to circulate to the three 303rd BG(H) members that are with our > > Missouri Chapter/St. Louis Wing of the 8th AFHS. I'm attaching the >names > > and addresses of the three in the event the 303rd BGA does not have them >as > > members. If you do have a spare, send it to me and I will prepare > > envelopes, labels and postage so that all they have to do is watch the >tape > > and send it on. Thanks, Lloyd! Kevin Pearson, 2514 W. Woodland, St. > > Joseph, MO 64506. > > > > Leslie W. Giddings 915 S.E. 5th St. Lee's Summitt, MO 64063 303 BG > > Harry H. Schulz 9748 MacKenzie Rd. St. Louis, MO 63123-5400 303 BG > > John A. Thurmon Box 30B Wellington, MO 64097 303 BG > > > > > > > > >From: "Lloyd J Grant" > > >Reply-To: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com > > >To: <303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com> > > >Subject: [303rd-Talk] The Moleworth tape > > >Date: Fri, 3 Aug 2001 16:44:50 -0400 > > > > > >To all: > > > > > >The tape originally provided by Don Kehne, which might have been more > > >suitably titled, " The Kellog Tape" has now run the course. I would >like > > >to > > >thank everyone who participated and contributed to the distribution of >the > > >tape. As far as I am concerned, it was worth the effort if it brought >any > > >satisfaction at all to those who viewed it. > > > > > >Special thanks to Don Kehne ( who provided the tape originally), Harry > > >Goebrecht ( who provided an explaination of the various scenes), Bill > > >Jones > > >( who took the time to research the tape and share his information), to > > >Bill > > >Owens ( who indentified the various aircraft and serial numbers) , Gary > > >Moncur for providing extra copies ( which I gave away to other >members), > > >Anne Grant for relaying messages to the Group while I was absent, to > > >Maurice Paulk for providing a copy to the Florida members ( I still >have > > >your copy, pard ), to Donna Morrows for paying the extra postage to get >a > > >copy to Robin Beeby in the UK ( one of Garys'), and to everyone for >the > > >solidarity and comradery expressed when I went TDY away from the forum. > > > > > >Hopefully, I will be a mellower feller now that I am back, but I >recommend > > >you keep on good terms with your parachute riggers, none-the-less. I > > >missed you all; and that's no embellishment of the truth. > > > > > >Thank you. > > > > > >Lloyd. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at >http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Mon Aug 6 14:48:19 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Kevin Pearson) Date: Mon, 06 Aug 2001 08:48:19 -0500 Subject: [303rd-Talk] CCRC Message-ID: Hi Jack! Thanks for the e-mail. Very interesting about your convoy and submarine siting!!! And a Navigator that can't navigate. Well, it was the Army! Here is a little ditty I found on the internet about the Aquatania: John Maxtone-Graham in "Liners to the Sun," recounts a funny story about Aquitania's first WWII crossing back to England. By the time WWII rolled around, Aquitania remained the sole four-funnel ship in the world. An old destroyer from the reserves came out to meet her and signaled with an Aldis lamp..."FOUR FUNNEL SHIP PLEASE INDICATE. (Captain) George Gibbon's remark when told the signal was classic: "We are the only ***** four-funnel ship in the world and that so-and-so wants our name. Tell him to read 'The News of the World.' The next signal was DO YOU REQUIRE AN ESCORT, (our) reply CAN YOU KEEP UP. The final signal as we drew away, still at full speed: YOUR FINE SPEED REQUIRES LITTLE PROTECTION." >From: Jprencher@aol.com >Reply-To: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com >To: 303rd-talk@303rdbga.com >Subject: Re: [303rd-Talk] CCRC >Date: Sun, 5 Aug 2001 01:06:38 EDT > >Kevin, The Aquatania as I remember was next in size to the 2 Queens. We had >an all English crew and I think 16,000 American troops aboard, so it was >crowded. We ate 2 meals per day and I think there was a chow line around >the >clock. I thought the food was adequate but naturally nothing fancy. The >officers had the upper decks and I was in a state room with 11 others. >There >was a head between our state room and the one next door which we shared. >Spike Jones and his city slickers were in the next one going over to >entertain the troops so we had Music? as they rehearsed a lot Our enlisted >men were in the lower decks and in hammocks and bunks that were a lot more >crowded. Our crew was very near the propeller shafts and rudder so it >creaked >every time they turned a bit. We went alone not in a convoy as our ship >was >faster than any submarine in the world so no one could stock us They could >have got ahead of us and got us as we went by so we changed course every 5 >minutes or so. It took us about 5 days to make the crossing. I was one of >the >16 or so of us that drew a 4 hour watch every 12 hours. my station was >starboard side of the bridge about 60 feet above the water. Sometimes it >was >so foggy I couldn't see the water but on the trip I did spot one submarine >which turned out to be a whale. I also spotted a convoy of ships which >turned out to be a bunch of rocks on the coast of Ireland. > > I was a pilot, copilot navigator and have an FAA A&E aircraft >mechanics >license. It's a good thing I was a navigator as our Navigator couldn't read >a >map flying along the coast at 1000 feet in CAVU weather. He never knew >where >we were unless I told him and then he would be lost again in the next 10 >miles. He was good on the gee box. He and I worked out a blind landing >system with it that we could and did several time use it to land at >Molesworth in Zero Zero conditions. It wasn't a one man operation. He ran >the g box and I ran the airplane and the engineer called out the airspeed >and >the rest of the crew prayed We hit the runway every time but had one H--- >of >a time taxing to the parking area as the Gee didn't work when we were on >the >ground. One time the engineering officer who was not a pilot went up on a >test flight with us acting as copilot. when we touched down I bounced about >6 >bounces before it finally stayed on the ground. He was very nervous and >started counting the bounces, one two three four. I told him he just as >well >quit counting I was not about to go around > > I just read your letter again to see if I answered all your questions. >I >don't think there were many sick GIs. The ship was so big it didn't rock >much. There was no rough seas on our trip. It was very crowed but other >than >that not uncomfortable. >Jack Rencher >Box 7927 >Boise ID 83707 That's Idaho "Home of the good potatoes" > _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Mon Aug 6 16:06:02 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Tooley, Dave) Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 10:06:02 -0500 Subject: [303rd-Talk] Crosshairs newsletter Message-ID: Hi all, I was reading Andy Rooney's book "My War" last week and he mentioned a newsletter called "Crosshairs". This is a newsletter for an organization of bombardiers. I have looked for them on the net with no luck. Does anyone out there know about them and how I can contact them? Thanks!! Dave Tooley From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Mon Aug 6 16:45:05 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Kevin Pearson) Date: Mon, 06 Aug 2001 10:45:05 -0500 Subject: [303rd-Talk] Crosshairs newsletter Message-ID: Hi Dave, I have heard of them and it seems like they were based out of Louisiana, but I don't have an address. Kevin >From: "Tooley, Dave" >Reply-To: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com >To: "303rd Email List (E-mail)" <303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com>, "Heavy Bombers >Email (E-mail)" >Subject: [303rd-Talk] Crosshairs newsletter >Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 10:06:02 -0500 > >Hi all, >I was reading Andy Rooney's book "My War" last week and he mentioned a >newsletter called "Crosshairs". This is a newsletter for an organization >of >bombardiers. I have looked for them on the net with no luck. Does anyone >out there know about them and how I can contact them? >Thanks!! > >Dave Tooley > > _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Mon Aug 6 17:36:25 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com) Date: Mon, 06 Aug 2001 16:36:25 +0000 Subject: [303rd-Talk] Crosshairs newsletter Message-ID: <20010806163625.YYCT12706.mtiwmhc21.worldnet.att.net@webmail.worldnet.att.net> Kevin, I don't think the Bombardiers Organization exists any more. "Crosshairs" was the name of their publication. I used to receive it. I think it was published in the State of Michigan but I don't remember where.....Bill Runnels, bombardier From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Mon Aug 6 16:40:07 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Fory Barton) Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 10:40:07 -0500 Subject: [303rd-Talk] Tape Message-ID: <000e01c11e8e$12f94580$069a46c6@computer> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01C11E64.290D87C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable If not too late, I would also like to view the tape that has been = circulating. So please put me on the list. Thanks!!! Fory Barton 731 E. North St. Galesburg, IL 61401 ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01C11E64.290D87C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

If not too late, I would also like to = view the=20 tape that has been circulating.

So please put me on the list. =20 Thanks!!!

Fory Barton

731 E. North St.

Galesburg, IL = 61401

------=_NextPart_000_000B_01C11E64.290D87C0-- From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Mon Aug 6 19:58:18 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Walter Swanson) Date: Mon, 06 Aug 2001 11:58:18 -0700 Subject: [303rd-Talk] Tapes Message-ID: Would like to get on the tape list.. Walt Swanson From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Mon Aug 6 20:37:04 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (JOHN W. FORD) Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 14:37:04 -0500 Subject: [303rd-Talk] BRANSON REUNION 2002 Message-ID: <001701c11eaf$3027a860$cdbe530c@oemcomputer> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0012_01C11E85.43289020 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable HI TO ALL 303RD MEMBERS. THE BRANSON, MISSOURI REUNION FOR 2002 IS = SCHEDULED FOR OCT. 3 - 8, 2002.YOU CAN VISIT THE WEB SITE ESTABLISHED BY = THE REUNION PLANNING CENTER FOR MORE INFORMATION. THE WEB SITE IS = www.reunionproregistration.com/303rdbombgroup.htm JOHN FORD ------=_NextPart_000_0012_01C11E85.43289020 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

HI TO ALL 303RD MEMBERS. THE = BRANSON,=20 MISSOURI REUNION FOR 2002 IS SCHEDULED FOR OCT. 3 - 8, 2002.YOU CAN = VISIT THE=20 WEB SITE ESTABLISHED BY THE REUNION PLANNING CENTER FOR MORE = INFORMATION. =20 THE WEB SITE IS www.reu= nionproregistration.com/303rdbombgroup.htm

JOHN FORD

------=_NextPart_000_0012_01C11E85.43289020-- From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Mon Aug 6 21:08:49 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Kevin Pearson) Date: Mon, 06 Aug 2001 15:08:49 -0500 Subject: [303rd-Talk] Bombs Message-ID: Yesterday I was watching "Air Power" on the History Channel, which basically was a rewrite of the original Memphis Belle. But there were a few scenes included that were not in the Belle. Two scenes showed bombs being dropped, but these bombs had red and white lines about a foot wide each painted around them. I've seen countless photos of bomb dumps and the "hogs," the carcasses of the various sizes of bombs, and all of the bombs were painted O.D. Green. Perhaps the footage used was training footage for bombardiers or other training films. Do any of you guys remember having red stripes painted on your bombs and if so, for what purpose? Kevin _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Mon Aug 6 21:30:47 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com) Date: Mon, 06 Aug 2001 20:30:47 +0000 Subject: [303rd-Talk] Bombs Message-ID: <20010806203047.CCFA12706.mtiwmhc21.worldnet.att.net@webmail.worldnet.att.net> Kevin, the only bomb with a single red band was an irritant smoke (vomiting gas). We never carried these and I doubt that they were used very often if ever. I have no idea what the two red bands were. ...Bill Runnels, bombardier > Yesterday I was watching "Air Power" on the History Channel, which basically > was a rewrite of the original Memphis Belle. But there were a few scenes > included that were not in the Belle. Two scenes showed bombs being dropped, > but these bombs had red and white lines about a foot wide each painted > around them. I've seen countless photos of bomb dumps and the "hogs," the > carcasses of the various sizes of bombs, and all of the bombs were painted > O.D. Green. Perhaps the footage used was training footage for bombardiers > or other training films. Do any of you guys remember having red stripes > painted on your bombs and if so, for what purpose? > Kevin > > _________________________________________________________________ > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp > > From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Mon Aug 6 21:56:49 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Michael Baldock) Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 21:56:49 +0100 Subject: [303rd-Talk] To Say Hello Message-ID: <003e01c11eba$aac3e600$83a4fc3e@oemcomputer> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_002F_01C11EC2.B16BB840 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello, to say that I have just joined this list today, did not realise = that there was such a comprehensive site dedicated to a WW2 Group on the = www. Excellent stuff. My interest is threefold: 1) I run a couple of very amateur websites, one of which features a few = current photos of USAF "Ghost" airfields, namely relics of the Cold War. = Molesworth is one of these and the fortunes of this unique airfield have = greatly varied since 1945. I would like to add material covering the = period 1945 to the present day. Interestingly is the most = searched for word that leads to my site. You might not like my write-up = of my visit there though! 2) There was a USAAF hospital or recuperation unit at Guys Marsh near = Shaftesbury in Dorset, England, and after the war it was used as a = transit or orientation camp for US airmen entering the UK before being = sent to their allocated bases. If you remember Guys Marsh, or know = someone else who went there, could you please get in touch with me as I = would like to create a web page covering it's history (I grew up in = Shaftesbury). 3) My Father flew the Hawker Tempest in Germany with the Royal Air Force = in 1946/47 and I started a web site which contains many of the photos = that he took over there. This included some wrecked aircraft at Fassberg = including a B-17G "Heavy Date" and several Luftwaffe aircraft. Like so = many of his era he has passed on however I look at his photos and it = feels as if I am transported back to a very different time. Anyway, I am pleased to be here. Michael Baldock http://only.at/mikesjets "Rolling Thunder" Classic Jets http://only.at/ghosts "USAF Ghosts" Airfields of the Cold War http://freespace.virgin.net/michael.baldock/index "Tempest Pilot" =20 ------=_NextPart_000_002F_01C11EC2.B16BB840 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hello, to say that I have just joined = this list=20 today, did not realise that there was such a comprehensive site = dedicated to a=20 WW2 Group on the www. Excellent stuff.

My interest is threefold:

1) I run a couple of very amateur = websites, one of=20 which features a few current photos of USAF "Ghost" airfields, = namely=20 relics of the Cold War. Molesworth is one of these and the fortunes of = this=20 unique airfield have greatly varied since 1945. I would like to = add =20 material covering the period 1945 to the present day. Interestingly=20 <Molesworth> is the most searched for word that leads to = my site. You=20 might not like my write-up of my visit there though!

2) There was a USAAF hospital or = recuperation unit=20 at Guys Marsh near Shaftesbury in Dorset, England, and after the = war it was=20 used as a transit or orientation camp for US airmen entering the UK = before being=20 sent to their allocated bases. If you remember Guys Marsh, or know = someone else=20 who went there, could you please get in touch with me as I would like=20 to create a web page covering it's history (I grew up in=20 Shaftesbury).

3) My Father flew the Hawker Tempest in = Germany=20 with the Royal Air Force in 1946/47 and I started a web site which = contains=20 many of the photos that he took over there. This included some wrecked = aircraft=20 at Fassberg including a B-17G "Heavy Date" and several Luftwaffe = aircraft. Like=20 so many of his era he has passed on however I look at his photos=20 and it feels as if I am transported back to a very different=20 time.

Anyway, I am pleased to be = here.

Michael Baldock

http://only.at/mikesjets = "Rolling=20 Thunder" Classic Jets

http://only.at/ghosts "USAF = Ghosts"=20 Airfields of the Cold War

http://freespa= ce.virgin.net/michael.baldock/index =20 "Tempest Pilot"

------=_NextPart_000_002F_01C11EC2.B16BB840-- From 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com Mon Aug 6 22:05:20 2001 From: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com (Michael Baldock) Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 22:05:20 +0100 Subject: [303rd-Talk] To Say Hello References: <003e01c11eba$aac3e600$83a4fc3e@oemcomputer> Message-ID: <005601c11ebb$81009060$83a4fc3e@oemcomputer> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0053_01C11EC3.E24F7A40 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable One small mistake, the link to "Tempest Pilot" is: http://freespace.virgin.net/michael.baldock/index.htm Sorry about that. ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Michael Baldock=20 To: 303rd-talk@303rdBGA.com=20 Sent: Monday, August 06, 2001 9:56 PM Subject: [303rd-Talk] To Say Hello Hello, to say that I have just joined this list today, did not realise = that there was such a comprehensive site dedicated to a WW2 Group on the = www. Excellent stuff. My interest is threefold: 1) I run a couple of very amateur websites, one of which features a = few current photos of USAF "Ghost" airfields, namely relics of the Cold = War. Molesworth is one of these and the fortunes of this unique airfield = have greatly varied since 1945. I would like to add material covering = the period 1945 to the present day. Interestingly is the = most searched for word that leads to my site. You might not like my = write-